Is Windows 10 really this "bad"?

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  • Bry89 wrote:
    I wonder... has anybody used this in their place of work/college/university yet? It seems that people are only getting an experience from it through home use. Might be different elsewhere like, for the Pro and Enterprise versions.

    It's a very slow roll-out. At my last job by the time I left in the CA move pretty much 3/4ths of the company was migrated to 10. The others were a weird mix of 7, 8 and 8.1. For a while it wasn't allowed, I was #3 or #4 who was running it due to some weird problems I was having in 8.1. We didn't use anything too special that was built around some 20 year old version of win32 like a lot of businesses *still* have.
  • stitch wrote:
    Bry89 wrote:
    I wonder... has anybody used this in their place of work/college/university yet? It seems that people are only getting an experience from it through home use. Might be different elsewhere like, for the Pro and Enterprise versions.

    It's a very slow roll-out. At my last job by the time I left in the CA move pretty much 3/4ths of the company was migrated to 10. The others were a weird mix of 7, 8 and 8.1. For a while it wasn't allowed, I was #3 or #4 who was running it due to some weird problems I was having in 8.1. We didn't use anything too special that was built around some 20 year old version of win32 like a lot of businesses *still* have.
    Yeah, I figured that anyway. So far, 7 holds 40% of the market share, and the roll-out is this slow because of the free upgrade no longer being around. Well, I prefer it that way anyway... though I worry how long would it take for 10 to eventually take over 7.

    Also, I didn't know updates can be turned off in the Enterprise edition. I suppose that's... alright, if some business using it needs to do that.
  • Bry89 wrote:
    stitch wrote:
    Bry89 wrote:
    I wonder... has anybody used this in their place of work/college/university yet? It seems that people are only getting an experience from it through home use. Might be different elsewhere like, for the Pro and Enterprise versions.

    It's a very slow roll-out. At my last job by the time I left in the CA move pretty much 3/4ths of the company was migrated to 10. The others were a weird mix of 7, 8 and 8.1. For a while it wasn't allowed, I was #3 or #4 who was running it due to some weird problems I was having in 8.1. We didn't use anything too special that was built around some 20 year old version of win32 like a lot of businesses *still* have.
    Yeah, I figured that anyway. So far, 7 holds 40% of the market share, and the roll-out is this slow because of the free upgrade no longer being around. Well, I prefer it that way anyway... though I worry how long would it take for 10 to eventually take over 7.

    Also, I didn't know updates can be turned off in the Enterprise edition. I suppose that's... alright, if some business using it needs to do that.

    I think we are going to see a sizable amount of hold-outs on 7 as we did on XP (which *still* holds like 9% to this day). It was hell getting migrated even to that and for a lot of people, that wasn't that long ago. The end of 7's support currently is January 14, 2020 but I can see that having to be extended.
  • My university has rolled out Windows 10, which kind of surprises me, but then again they usually keep current.

    10 has also been rolled out to several clients we support and we had a lot of headaches with it when the anniversary update was pushed out, because for whatever reason, that broke a lot of stuff.
  • stitch wrote:
    I think we are going to see a sizable amount of hold-outs on 7 as we did on XP (which *still* holds like 9% to this day).

    I agree with you there.
    stitch wrote:
    The end of 7's support currently is January 14, 2020 but I can see that having to be extended.

    I don't really think Microsoft will do that really. Microsoft regrets extending XP support, and I think they will stick to their guns this time and not extend support for 7.
    BlueSun wrote:
    10 has also been rolled out to several clients we support and we had a lot of headaches with it when the anniversary update was pushed out, because for whatever reason, that broke a lot of stuff.

    That probably explains why so many people are holding out. I myself am trying to avoid Windows 10 as much as I can.
  • I'm trying to get used to 10, but haven't brought myself to upgrade any of my main machines yet.

    I've had a couple of projects recently using Server 2016 and for the most part it's ok, but one thing that annoys me is the credential dialog now requires me to click "More options" before I can enter a different user name... so something that used to take one click or even just down arrow down to it, now requires two clicks. It always annoys the shit out of me when Microsoft does this. Eventually I'll get used to it, I guess.. but it just seems poor design to require more work...
  • I think it depends on H/W.

    I have several i5 machines and installed Windows 10 OS on i5 4th and 6th machines.
    Perfomance seems to be stable and good perfomance than Windows 7 if Automatic Update is disable.

    Windows 10 will be more improved on new H/W (Especially Intel 7th generation H/W, or AMD new H/W.)

    On the other hand, Windows 7 will have more demerit when the new H/W is released.
  • If Windows 7's support does get extended, even if it's only what stitch had envisioned, then personally that would be great. I did know that XP's support was extended before... from its original end date to be somewhere in 2007 if I recall correctly. Also, I thought XP only had a 5% market share, as of last month. But no matter what number it is, it has proven to be immortal and that 7 would go the same way.
  • Surprise, Surprise </sarcasm>

    Windows 10's game mode is just plain useless.

    http://www.ghacks.net/2017/01/28/initial-windows-10-game-mode-benchmarks-disappoint/
  • I replaced H/W as follows.

    CPU : i5 6600 --> i5 7600
    RAM : 32GB DDR4 (2133MHz) --> 32GB DDR4 (2400MHz)

    I've tested both i5 7600 (Windows 10) and i5 600 (Windows 7).
    (Each machines have same SDD and HDD)

    I didn't use benchmark program.
    But I feel that Windows 10 is more fast and smooth than Windows 7.

    Windows 10 will have more advantage than Windows 7 if H/W performance is more improved.
  • Apparently Microsoft has added in the latest insider builds an option to block the installation of programs that are not from the Windows Store.

    http://www.ghacks.net/2017/02/27/window ... tallation/
  • dosbox wrote:
    Apparently Microsoft has added in the latest insider builds an option to block the installation of programs that are not from the Windows Store.

    http://www.ghacks.net/2017/02/27/window ... tallation/

    I wonder if this is MS trying to make a push toward app-only Windows or if this is to prevent computer-illiterate users from accidentally clicking on ads and installing Bonzi Buddy

    edit: Wait, Cortana is already installed. She's just not as fun as old Bonzi
  • jrepperger wrote:
    dosbox wrote:
    Apparently Microsoft has added in the latest insider builds an option to block the installation of programs that are not from the Windows Store.

    http://www.ghacks.net/2017/02/27/window ... tallation/

    I wonder if this is MS trying to make a push toward app-only Windows

    It is actually; They've been trying to do this since they started working on Windows 8 and Windows RT.
  • So with that known, is Windows 10 now only going to accept programs from Microsoft, or what? I mean, I hope it can still allow anyone to install programs that would be accepted by them, like how macOS's Gatekeeper works. Not letting anyone install GIMP or LibreOffice would be a bad day.
  • They can try and do whatever they want with their business practices, but if they decide to do a move as drastic as this, then 99% of customers will refuse to upgrade. So ultimately Microsoft won't be winning anything here and potentially bringing life to competitors.
  • That article mentions that it's an option, not enabled by default. I seriously doubt they'd completely remove the ability to install non-store apps. But having an option that you can enable via GUI and/or GPO to block the installation of non-store apps makes sense and I could definitely see them doing that.

    Technically, it is already possible to do this via GPO / registry, but it's not great. So this may just be an improvement of the existing feature.
  • So, I tried out Win10 for the first time ever in my voluntary work placement today and let me say this... I fucking hate it. I really, really do. One attempt at using scroll lock with the mouse and I'm warped to that goddamn "Start Screen" where I panicked only then to come out from it with help of Esc. Also, complete regression in design as what we all complained about since the beginning. Never again am I using it, EVER. Thankfully, there's a Mac there that I would be using so, problem solved.

    If this travesty of an OS ever takes over 7 in the market share in a few years, with even the best businesses out there cursed with this, then the whole world will implode. Unless Microsoft does yet another screw-up and make us use Linux instead. Since I used that thing after such a long time of avoiding it, I felt like I needed to rinse out my eyes with vinegar because it's downright terrible, and we all know it. And yes, I am fully aware that I'm beating a dead horse again this way but, I had to get this off my chest.

    (other than that, my first day at the job was good, in case anybody wanted to know)
  • Bry89 wrote:
    So, I tried out Win10 for the first time ever in my voluntary work placement today and let me say this... I fucking hate it. I really, really do. One attempt at using scroll lock with the mouse and I'm warped to that goddamn "Start Screen" where I panicked only then to come out from it with help of Esc. Also, complete regression in design as what we all complained about since the beginning. Never again am I using it, EVER. Thankfully, there's a Mac there that I would be using so, problem solved.

    If this travesty of an OS ever takes over 7 in the market share in a few years, with even the best businesses out there cursed with this, then the whole world will implode. Unless Microsoft does yet another screw-up and make us use Linux instead. Since I used that thing after such a long time of avoiding it, I felt like I needed to rinse out my eyes with vinegar because it's downright terrible, and we all know it. And yes, I am fully aware that I'm beating a dead horse again this way but, I had to get this off my chest.

    (other than that, my first day at the job was good, in case anybody wanted to know)

    I can tell you right now that your opinion falls squarely in the minority. Windows 10 will have no problems displacing 7 as the major OS in the next few years. Especially once MS ends extended support for it. And the already discontinued support for newer processors like Kaby Lake and Ryzen means the mass exodus to 10 will probably happen sooner.

    There are genuine reasons to dislike 10 (telemetry, forced updates, less efficient navigation due to moving to modern apps for settings, etc). But simply because it's different or has an updated style is not a reason to dislike it or to avoid using it.
  • Anything that Microsoft releases will displace the older versions eventually, no matter how bad the new stuff is. Most of their products have enough lock in that there is little real choice.

    There are some genuine major user interface flaws in Windows 10, but not everybody knows how how to accurately describe the issues other than "it sucks". That doesn't mean the issues aren't there. I don't care to enumerate the issues here either.
  • I knew someone would berate me for what I just said... but I had to let it out regardless. If I was ever in an IT job in the future, I'd rather use Linux, not this modern-age junk. You have no idea how frustrated I was when I had to use it just that one time and I almost thought about putting my first through the monitor.

    I just hope 7 will hang around for a good bit, when we're talking market shares here. As far as I know, most computers still use it which is good, even local libraries. This company only had it because it was a small business and I think they took advantage of the free upgrade that was around then. I was only forced to use a machine running 10 because I couldn't access most of the apps on that Mac due to not having permission to access them, which should be solved for the next time I come (and that only happened because the IT guy happened to be away).

    If I had settled with this Mac no bother, then I wouldn't have made my full-blown complaint about it.
  • I look at Windows 10 from an administrator's POV.

    It is expected that by 2018 most of the United States government systems will have migrated to Windows 10 Enterprise.
    This is interesting, considering the complete migration off of XP was performed at almost the last minute, and the same with the migration from Windows 2000. Windows 7 will still have 2 years of support left by the time migration will have been completed.

    Working as a civilian at one of their bases, I have gone through countless courses and introductions to Windows 10 administration, among other things. With Windows 10, and starting with 8, Microsoft has removed, regrouped, and modified much of the admin base. Networking is a bit of a pain now, and all the xaml nonsense is still full of vulnerabilities and workarounds. Not to mention, it's extremely painful to deal with Microsoft's new restrictions on what you can configure.
    In addition, we are concerned about the telemetry and its possibility as a backdoor. While the standard policy templates will have it disabled, the components are still there.
    Also, we were shown videos on how to act if we encounter certain bugs in Windows 10. As well as how to deal with panicking users if programs they use do in fact fail. Funny.
    Thankfully, the mass deployments will not be difficult. I do fear for the growing number of legacy programs still in use. Several were dodgy with 7, and how they will act with 10 is not in my department.

    Take a look:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dUeachZkNxY
    A little outdated though, but this is some of the stuff sent out to ready up folks.

    "streamlined" "secure" "superior". Yeah sure. The true fact of what is behind those actually increases the difficulty to maintain it.
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